Elections Commission Regular Meeting - January 17, 2024

excellent okay so we're going to start this meeting over um apologies to the public and uh the rest of the commission

for those technical difficulties um we are ready to begin welcome to the

January 17th 2024 regular meeting of the San Francisco elections commission I'm

the president Robin Stone The Time Is Now 6:12 p.m. and I call the meeting to order before we proceed further i' would

like to ask commission secretary Marissa Davis to briefly explain some procedures for participating in today's

meeting can you hear me yes the meetings uh the minutes of this

meeting will reflect that the meeting is being held in person at City Hall Room 408 one Dr Carlton B goodlet place in

San Francisco and remotely via WebEx as authorized by the elections commission's

February 15 2023 vote members of the public May attend the meeting to observe

and provide public comment either at the physical meeting location or remotely

details and instructions for participating remotely are listed on the commission's website and on today's

meeting agenda public comment will be available on each item of this agenda

each member of the public will be allowed three minutes to speak six minutes if you are on the line with an

interpreter when providing public comment you are encouraged to state your name clearly once your three minutes

have expired the staff will thank you and you will be muted please address your comments to the entire commission

and not to a specific individual while providing public comment remotely please

ensure that you are in a quiet location when joining by phone you will hear a beep when you are connected to the

meeting you will be automatic ly muted and in listening mode only to make a

public comment dial Star three to raise your hand when your item of Interest comes up you will be added to the public

comment line you will hear you have raised your hand to ask a question please wait until the host calls on you

the line will be silent as you wait your turn to speak if at any time you change

your mind and wish to withdraw yourself from the public comment line press star three again and you will hear the system

say you have lowered your hand when joining by WebEx or web browser make

sure the participant side panel is showing by clicking on the participants icon at the bottom of the list of

attendees is a small button or icon that looks like a hand press the hand icon to

raise your hand you will be unmuted when it is your time to comment when you are

done with your comment click the hand icon to lower your hand in addition to

participating in real time interested persons are encouraged to participate in this meeting by submitting public

comment in writing by 12: noon on the day of the meeting to elections. commmission

sfgov.org it will be shared with the commission after this meeting has concluded and will be included as part

of the official meeting file thank you president Stone thank you secretary Davis Will you

pre please proceed with item one commission roll call yes president pres Stone present vice president

jeronic here commissioner bernh holes here commissioner Dy here commissioner

Hayden Crowley here commissioner loli here commissioner Parker here president

stone with seven members present and accounted for you have a quorum excellent and commissioner D will you

recite the land acknowledgement for today's meeting yes yes the San Francisco

elections commission acknowledges that we are on the unseated ancestral homeland of the ramitos alone who are

the original inhabitants of the San Francisco Peninsula as the indigenous stewards of this land and in accordance

with their Traditions the ramitos alone have never seeded lost nor forgotten their responsibilities as caretakers of

this place as well as for All Peoples who reside in their traditional territory as guests we recognize that we

benefit from living and working on their traditional Homeland we wish to pay our respect by acknowledging the ancestors

and relatives of the ritos community and affir affirming their Sovereign rights as First

Peoples thank you commissioner D that closes out agenda item number one um

agenda item before we move actually to agenda item number two I just wanted to announce a quick agenda just or change

in order so uh agenda item number four is the director's report and then agenda

item number five is commissioner's report and then agenda item number six is policies and priorities review and um

we're actually going to move agenda item number six between 4 and five um so that

the director can stay for that discussion and then um we will pick back

up with agenda item number five so just to rephrase that the item will go the

order of items will go agenda item number four agenda item number six then agenda item number five let's move to

agenda item number two general public comment public comment on any issue within the elections commission's

General jurisdiction that is not covered by another item on this

agenda there are no hands

raised okay there are no hands raised great thank you um we will close

out agenda item number two and move to agenda item number three approval of previous meeting minutes discussion and

possible action on previous elections commission meeting minutes um so uh just

to kick this off quickly uh the we had had these items for the most part

agendized in December they were postponed due to the amount of material that we had to

get through last meeting um and then additionally I was asked to put together

just a little memo on uh our how on our meeting minutes in general um and those

just to quickly run through what is on that document it just explain pulls the

specific section of the sunshine ordinance um uh walking through what is

required for meeting minutes and then also pulls a highlevel explanation of

the Roberts rules uh the Roberts rules pertaining to meeting minutes there are

way more Roberts rules than what is included in here uh if folks recall from

a a year ago it's crazy that was already a year ago um we the I put together a

very abbreviated I think two sheeter on Robert's rules that the commission could

follow to uh manage and run operate our meetings and uh included in that

document was ALS Al a explanation of what is required um in meeting minutes

based on Robert rules Robert's Rules and our bylaws specifically state that we follow Robert's rules for our meeting

minutes um and then of course we are all obligated to comply with the San Francisco Sunshine ordinance so um that

is what you will find in the memo document and then uh the other items are

the September October November meeting minutes with commissioner D's revision

which we did not have the opportunity to get through um in the last meeting so I don't know if commissioner D you had

something specific you wanted to share to intro those edits um otherwise we can open it up to to

comment yeah just briefly I um uh my um edits

were often to fix typos uh and to improve

readability uh in some cases I try to make them more succinct um and also try to balance out

like in some cases I think particularly in the September meeting minutes there seem to be a lot of detail in some

things and no detail in others so so with my notes I try to balance that out

a little so that is um all I have to

say thank

you and if folks have forgotten since the new year you can just feel free to

raise your hand using the uh blue button on your on your

screen I can make a couple comments um if folks don't have any so I think where

I had concern because I had raised I had raised this um is that there isn't

really that much that we need to include in our meeting minutes and um I am I

have concerns with big substantive additions and

changes um that were that are more material or added specific context but

perhaps um added very specific context uh that I

felt perhaps were not necessary but maybe what one commissioner wanted

mentioned and so I had asked that the full commission review these to make sure they agreed with the changes um

before we approve and going forward part of the reason why I hoped that folks can

review the um the me Memo I put together

we can all just agree that we don't need to have these very lengthy edits I agree

that um you know if there are typos and things of that nature fine I also don't

think we need to over overload the commission secretary

with word changes that are just personal preference um and so that's my feeling

about it uh really we just need to make sure we comply with the sunshine ordinance and the specific asks of the

uh uh by of the um of Robert rules and I

don't think we need to make it more intense than that the other piece that I wanted to give feedback on is that I

think it's inappropriate for the commission to insert names of public commenters who did not provide their

names especially if a if they did not provide their last names um we're not

required to do that unless they offer it um we can it it specifically says um the

names and titles were appable um for close session but then the members of the public who spoke on each matter if

the speakers identified themselves um whether they supported or opposed and a

brief brief summary um of that agenda item but I don't think it's appropriate for us to add in our names just in case

we know them that is my personal preference um again open to hear other

people's feedback uh but I don't think that should be a practice of ours unless people offer their names those are my my

pieces yes commissioner Hayden

Crowley thank you president Stone uh I would agree with you and I also just

would add as just as a guideline um when I think when when I as I

understand how minutes should be prepared with Robert's Rule of orders according to Robert's Rule of Order and

also to just as a reminder we have a recording of every meeting so this is

just a sum the minutes are supposed to be a summary of our actions and and then also I believe that the bylaws or maybe

it's the sunshine ordinance that says that we have to identify the speakers and if and in in consistent with what

president Stone has said uh if they don't identify themselves I don't think that we should include their names we

should just share the information that they share but I would say as a rule

because they will typically give an opinion or whatever that um one good thing to do is to take any adjectives or

adverbs out of every um uh description

because I think that's a way that people then um can introduce bias and our goal

is to just present the facts straight up and it's up to any to if people want

more information they can simply refer to the recording and interpret it the way that they choose to because

everybody has a different perception of how things are uh presented and received so that

would be my recommendation but I also think that as the items come up if there

is no action taken so for example director ARS presents his report so director ARS

presents his report we have the document that shows what his report is if there's

no action taken then nothing more needs to be said because anybody can refer to

the recording if they want more information thank

you thank you commissioner Hayden Crowley

um uh secretary Davis would you mind actually closing the attendee box so I can see commissioner bernh hols thank

you so much just in case the commissioner raises their hand want to make sure I can

see commissioner commissioner

D yeah so um I don't have any problem with instituting that that um policy

moving forward um if someone doesn't introduce themselves that we don't identify them however in many cases they

did introduce themselves and it sometimes it's hard for um to catch the

name so uh or the correct spelling and if we happen to to have that information

I don't see why we shouldn't provide it I know that's something that uh that this commission has done in the past to

to try to get people's names correct um and then again I don't I don't have a

problem with moving forward I I think part of the challenge is that there's been a great

inconsistency uh in the minutes and what we capture and some minutes are very detailed and some you know are fairly

sparse and if we want to go with sparse moving forward I think that's fine uh although

as someone who has had to consult a lot of minutes lately um I think very few members of the public have the stamina

to to go through you know three-hour plus meetings uh recordings and so um

capturing a little bit of color is is not a terrible

idea thank you commissioner

d okay I will also respond this is President Stone there are multiple

instances commissioner D where you added people's names when it previously said Community member so I just want to be

very explicit like I think we all agree then I mean not we all agree the three

of us seem to be on the same page but if there's an area where a we couldn't

catch the name and they gave it that's one thing but if they didn't give their name I don't I personally would Advocate

against including it I think it's inappropriate um and I think members of

the public are entitled to that level of anonimity if they want it um and I hear

you about the inconsistency I think that's why I put together the memo is to give direction

um but I also think it's okay it doesn't need to be perfect uh and I you know I

think I I don't think we need to overdo it um I understand that you've had in

your experience recently in your review have needed to consult the minutes more

but um we do have you know we know what agenda items there were the secretary

does put up the recording there are many ways to access it without us having to

drag on link the minutes discussions which has happened ever since I've been on this commission so I think going

forward let's keep it brief Let's uh let's uh really stick to what we are

required to do and hopefully if we can have some general consensus that the

names of folks are only included if they've explicitly provided it provided

their names and of course edits to spelling are welcomed um are welcomed as

well uh would folks I been interested to hear other members of the commission

this is more just a general topic than it is specifically around the September

October November

minutes commissioner Parker um thank you I appreciate the

memo um and would agree with um generally

this discussion think you know I agree with the the comment about the members of the public um and only including

their names if they provide it and if there is some knowledge to get a correct spelling or um or you know the name and

it was UND misunderstood in the you know the instance itself that it's fine to correct so I agree with all of that um

and I appreciate with the memo kind of key words that I would say I took away is that what was done versus said is

just kind of reiterating what has um already been said and and would encourage us yeah moving forward to do

these things um I um I appreciate the last thing that

you just said president Stone I uh of us not trying to be too focused on perfect

um because I don't know that that's the best use of our time um accurate is um

probably the most important you know um and you know and when we're when

we're capturing what was done the topics um the the very high level you know if

there is a document that definitely covers um what was uh shared in that item great but very highlevel topics and

um and focusing on accuracy as opposed to perfect is um is where we should put our energy because we have a lot more

things to spend our time on in our meetings um so that's all I have thank

you commissioner Parker

okay um I otherwise think I my feedback

specifically is about going forward so otherwise if Commissioners don't have

concerns with the with what uh commissioner D has provided in feedback

previously My Hope Is that we can have General consensus about the process

going forward um but if anyone has concerns or um feedback about

commissioner D's feedback on those minutes from the last year or from last year's

minutes please raise those now otherwise I'm just going to ask for General consensus that we move to adopt the

drafted changes from commissioner D okay let's not drag it on much longer

okay so we are going to accept commissioner D minutes changes

uh for the September October November meetings um and going forward with our

uh minutes we will try and keep them brief and fairly consistent where

possible uh using folks's name if provided and spell check and you know

edits accuracy changes word uh grammar it spelling Etc are welcomed in feedback

changes yes vice president jonic yeah thank you president Stone I think also like another thing we

could do is um you know during public comment we could remind members of the public that if they would like their

name reflected in the minutes they could just identify themselves because some people might

forget that's all thank you thank you vice president jonic anyone have

any I think that personally I think that's a good idea happy to happy to to

ask uh secretary Davis to include that in the um in the

script okay so we don't need to vote on it but I just would love just a general nod everyone is agreement of the go

forward okay wonderful I'm glad we're getting these three off the plate and thank you commissioner D for your

extensive work on those appreciate it um let's move to public comment on agenda

item number three approval of previous meeting minutes

there are no hands

raised okay thank you secretary Davis that will close out agenda item

number three let's move to agenda item number four the January 2024 director's

report discussion and possible action regarding the month director's report and the many other items on his agenda

item oh yes commissioner Parker just just a quick um point of order and I may

have missed this because I knew you talked about the order of things were we supposed to do general public comment before the minutes we did and I just

wasn't paying it was brief no one was no one raised their hand thank you for keeping us

honest um yes director ARS thank you president

Stone so a couple of update well one update on my direct from my director's letter on item 1B we indicated that the

logic and accuracy would begin on January 17th however the the translator

that the Secretary of State's office uses was late in getting the final translations to the Secretary of State

who was then late getting the translations to the county so our testing will actually begin next Monday

on the 22nd we ised a press release today indicating uh that change

um then also just so the commission realizes ballots will be going out Friday and Saturday to overseas voters so we've we've already we already deep

into the election uh even though you haven't received your B Vo information pamphlet yet um and

then what so also at the end of the director's letter there's a list of items that we're providing the

Commissioners in relation to doing uh conducting Outreach for for the election so there's a list of items and I'll

leave this here you guys can can can grab it uh after the meeting I guess uh I don't know if you want to talk about

this now or how you want to go about the commission supporting the Outreach efforts for the Department uh but

president Stone had put forward previously uh how the Commissioners can support the department in conducting

Outreach for the March election and as far as Staffing any sort of events or

tabling or or things like that uh we we have sufficient Personnel for those activities but we think where the

Commissioners could be supportive of Outreach for the election is to actually

to use the materials which are also on our website there's links all these materials the digital copies on our

website too if you want to uh share those links with your friends but the idea is that the the Commissioners can

leverage their networks their friends and any events that they attend and and bring these Outreach materials or even

uh place them in your you know your your work areas or that you attend and that

would be probably a way to help us expand our reach more than you coming to something that we're already Staffing uh

so we have the materials here and they're also on our website and I'm glad to take any questions on that then also

attached to the director report is the election plan which uh the commission uh

would need to review and approve uh prior to the election and also there's a waiver that's attached to my director's

report and that waiver is is a is a is a release of the

prohibition of city employees assisting the department in conducting the election and that's part of the charter

amendment that created the elections commission uh there was there was language that prohibited city employees

from assisting the department in the past we've we've had Personnel from other departments help us with the

uploading of the results from the memory cartridges from memory device or memory cards from each polling place this

election we're going to do that work ourselves so we don't have a need for the extra Personnel from other

departments uh but so this is more of a general waiver of the prohibition and primarily we would appreciate any city

employees who uh are bilingual in Chinese Spanish and Filipino especially

uh to to volunteer as poll workers for election day uh so that's the purpose of this waiver then hopefully the

commission will approve the waiver and then it would be forwarded to the Board of Supervisors for for their final approval and then we could could

actually enlist city employees to to work as to volunteer as as pole workers

then also attached to it's in Incorporated in my director report and attached to the director report is

information on the uh Chinese character-based names uh that which was

a topic recently as we went with the nomination period and might be just in a

way better take questions on that but uh primarily I want to say that the department didn't change any any

requirements around the documentation or substantiation that uh potential candidates could submit to verify their

use of a character-based name uh but the board of the Board of Supervisors did pass a resolution unanimously requesting

that the department adopt a state law that incorporates two-year time frame

for candidates to be using a character based Chinese character based name uh

but the board can't change local law through through a res resolution they can only do through do so through

ordinance I don't know the board's approach I wasn't a part of any conversations on on the board uh

introducing And discussing and passing the the resolution but uh the department

considered the requests and although the local uh law the Mec section 401 does

not have a time frame attached to it the the state law has a time frame of two years we determin we could we could pass

a a a standard or we could Implement a standard of two years to to mirror the

state time frame which we implemented for this past election for this past

nomination period so the the document the the types of documents themselves

never changed there was no we're it's a very very liberal low threshold for

people to submit documentation in regards to their use of a character-based name uh so the only

thing that was different was the time frame where there's no time frame stated in local law there's now a two-year

standard a standard of of two years that we implemented then going forward uh I

will go to the board and have them formally uh adopt a two-year time frame in the local code as well um

so I think I'll just take questions from there so um uh director ER just in order

of operations I actually had one uh clarifying question the election plan we

need to approve prior to the March election correct so

recognizing I don't know if all the other Commissioners were able to get through the 70 pages of the election

plan yet um but would it be possible for us to

agendize that again at our next commission meeting as well or are you hoping to have the review and approval

today procedurally February is fine I mean the

election's continuing right so uh this is

basically a statement an overview of what we're doing to implement the election to conduct the election so

election will continue uh even if you wait until February to approve the plan thank you so what I was what I had in

mind was if folks were able to get through it um at length

um we I think let's try to get through it today if folks have continued

questions we can roll it into February but for the purposes of this

conversation let's start with the director's report questions pertaining to the director's report uh and and and

uh the specific items that he mentioned around Outreach and the wave and well

I'll come back to labor and the Chinese character um names and whatnot and then

let's move into the election review and if we need to we can always extend um

but we do need to take action on the waiver so I think let's start with our thoughts questions for the director

about the report then move to the waiver then move to the election plan if that

sounds good to everyone because I think it's a lot to tackle all at once is that does that work for you okay

um anything else director ARS before I hand it over to the thank you

okay yes vice president jonic uh thank you president Stone yeah thank you for

your report director um I uh just had one one question about

the Chinese character-based name I think we're on the waiver right now are we on the waiver we'll do the depart the

report questions first then we'll do the we'll take action on the waiver yeah

yeah but I I first wanted to mention that I I did see one of the the um

Department um advertisements on one of the bus the bus stops which was very

cool I saw it on 24th Street and it was very prominent you know was biking by so

it's um good work on that is that the first year you've done that design or the design yeah yeah changes every

election yeah and um so on the character base name I just wanted to get clarity on one um part of it because I know you

weren't here last month but so just to um just to kind of

summarize and then maybe you can tell me if I'm correct so the current ordinance it gives you a little bit of discretion

in what standards you want to apply for you know whether to adopt the names like

in which includes the time frame is that correct so the Mec has no time

frame yeah so it gives you discre on what time frame to adopt and then

um and then also related to that you're not required to have the board if you

decide on a certain time frame you're not required to have the board incorporate that into the law but it's

your preference right so that you don't yeah it's better to formalize the time frame in ordinance rather than have it

be a policy yeah okay yeah so I guess my one my one point of confusion was um the

last meeting the materials that were part of the packet said that you um it

said that you could change the time frame and then um but there was an

article in the San Francisco standard from like the week before saying that

you had already changed it and it was from December 4th and do

you know the article I'm talking about I don't yeah so there was an article on December 4th saying that some of the

candidates were complaining that you know that the 2-year requirement had been um implemented but then in the

materials to the commission it said that you were it didn't mention that you had already changed it

so were you um did you change it like in early December or in November or

no mid late December M okay after the fourth for sure so how did the

candidates know that it was two years or you hadn't told them at that point or it was it was more based on the information

that provided to us so if candidates didn't provide information to us that had that would reach back two years and

we contacted them okay so then it was later in the month that you decided to go forward with the two-year time frame

correct okay I got you that that clears up for me

thanks commissioner Hayden Crowley thank you president on

mute thank you president Stone um thank you director ARS for your comprehensive

report and your um awesome uh election plan um question you indicated in here

3A that you are continuing to hire an onboard about 200 temporary employees

and so is you indicated that I think that 70% of those are

returning of the 200 I think I I don't know if I read that in this report or the other one or the election plan I

don't think it's 70% I read it I read it in here I somewhere can not not in all instances

maybe in some areas but not in all instances like the ballot the people that will be doing the ballot distrib

the work with the ballots uh they're moving up the cards from the envelopes and that work they're

mostly they're going as we go as we move through the election cycle they're going to be mostly new Personnel oh okay yeah

so you're still hiring because I the I I just I am telling people that you're

hiring oh yeah and they they've applied and they've gotten the they've gotten an acknowledgement from DHR but they've

heard nothing after that it's been over a month that's why I asked yeah that's

yeah and that's I can't remember I think it was the election plan where we indicated that uh we're hiring in phases

so it's not just all at once so that we can actually accommodate the the the

workload better but also just the nature of the city's processes yes I understand

that we it's just and that's there's like the advertisement period you know

and then there's the all then even if we bring someone in for interview there's the the the onboarding pro so if someone

has applied and they've been and they've been acknowledged by DHR uh does it mean that we're not interested or may not

contact them it just a matter just depending where things are in the city's process processes and also where we are

with in our hiring cycle for specific positions depending on what they applied for okay okay I will let them know that

because I I am actually I told I told another person the other day to to apply

so I mean anybody that I know that's kind of you know I I because I figure you need good people we do yeah yeah and

if if if there's a job announcement still on DHR site then that position those positions are still EV still open

great okay thank you and thank you again for your uh comprehensive reporting well

thank you commissioner

Parker um thank you um as always um I have perhaps all of us kind of nerd out

on this stuff because that's why we're on this commission but reading reading your report I just was getting so

excited because it's I don't know elections are I like I like them a lot

um so I hope so I know I'm like I probably say that in this room everybody feels the same way um but you know

election day putting on the sticker after I vote and I just I just love it um so anyway um thank you so was fun to

read it um I let's see one thing um I had a question which I answered myself

and I'm going to just share for the Public's benefit um I had a question when I was reading is is where the

public could find the list of the 30 seven ballot drop boxes that would be open starting in a couple of weeks um

but again I answered my own question and so I just want to share with the public I actually did find it fairly easy to find um if you go to the Department's

website on the return your ballot page there's a map of dropboxes where you can find those if you want to drop your

ballot off before election day um and appreciate also the packets that you put

together and related to that um you know in your absence um last month when we had uh you know I appreciated the

suggestions of of how we could be involved which I realize this is part of that and then there was a one other item

in that short list and so I just want to um make sure that this is what you were speaking to earlier that said um that

Commissioners could help Place election door hangers on local residencies with no currently registered voters or election posters or utility on utility

infrastructure neighborhoods with below average historical turnout and so when you said we're pretty staffed and events

and things like that were you referring to that also or is this still an area you would appreciate commissioner help

on we would appreciate help that actually yeah so you want to show them your goodie the goodies you brought us I

don't think that's the same thing isn't no it need to be similar but yeah so if you could just provide more information

on like how we might be helpful on that particular item I would be interested in

hearing that um and then I think that's the only question I had the rest was

just enthusiasm and thanks I mean essentially we would those areas the map that that it's also these

these bags but uh that was in the the election plan indicates like the the

greenish yellowish areas of the of the city those are the areas that we want to be placing the hangers and then uh and

we're still organizing our Personnel ourselves to to do that work so if there's an area that you'd be interested

in you know you let me know so great and how much you can car

uh that's that's great I mean I like walking areas and doing that so happy to reach out all right that's great thank

you commissioner d uh director ARS um thank you we're

always in an awkward line of sight here um I wanted to thank you for coming up

with um a creative solution to the challenges that Chinese candidates were

having with their own names um as um we didn't have the chance to discuss it with you at the last meeting

but um uh I'm glad that you came up with a solution that was acceptable that that

the the policy that was trying to guard against cultural appropriation was actually causing a problem with people

who had the culture and so coming up with a solution that you know dealt with

the intent of the legislation um I think shows good judgment and I appreciate that uh

and also um as a fellow elections nerd I always appreciate your very detailed

elections plan um I as usual enjoyed the taglines

that your staff came up with um I also like the clever you know reuse of

Graphics of the Iota sticker that it's being used for you know other parts of

the campaign um and um I really like um the kind of evidence

based um tactics that you're working on to try to increase voter registration

which of course is the one of the elections commission's high priority so appreciated seeing that you know I vote

for my family I vote for my community I vote for the future I think that's fabulous and you know hits a lot of the

key demographics that are underrepresented so I just wanted to thank you for your work

than I'll jump in I guess we're going to just do it all the election plan and the

director's report um I had a couple of things so I just

wanted to Second commissioner D's comment about the solution for Chinese

names I know the department goes above and beyond to try

and make the process itself easier to not not be a roadblock um for candidates

uh trying to get on the ballot um and I know I I just wanted to give kudos to

the department for that um and if you know there are other issues that come up

with concerns I think it's shows that um there is obviously the commission if

folks have real you know if there's big issue um but I think it shows that the department resolved this in a way that

is actually Fair um and um also keeping the lens on how to support

how to keep how to support folks um so I just wanted to add some kudos to that um

and I actually wanted a point of clarification about commissioner perker your question you said it was separate

from the things that director Arns brought so I think I misunderstood what was your original question to

him um so in the his director's report for December right there were three ways

Commissioners could help and the the one it was number two of the three ways and

it was putting election door hangers on residences and when I looked at his list of what was included in this packet in

his report it didn't look like that's exactly oh what this it looked like a

different thing because the other cuz the number one thing in last month's report said to distribute election

packets containing registration forms br assures pole worker applications Etc so I took that as mostly meeting that need

and right did I read it correctly yeah that that first item is mostly that these packets are mostly the first item

in that list of three and the second item is a little distinct which we just discussed okay got it that was a very

detailed like you were much more detailed about that I just said oh great here are all the things um thank you for

clarifying um the uh I had a couple of questions

pertaining to specific areas of the director's report so what and you may

not know this off the top of your head director Arn what is the participation rate of overseas voters um because I

actually was surprised to see that the number of overseas like eligible is so high and I know that participation rate

of overseas voters at a national level is like tiny um for a variety of reasons

um so I'm curious what the participation of those folks is um in terms of

registration and also returning their their ballots even though they vote I

know electronically yes yeah most most of the time they still facts uh facts

wow yeah so imagine that there well the the the the potential registered uh

overseas voters I don't know that number I don't think anyone does uh as far as particip participation rates it depends

on the election some elections like the special elections we had in 2022 we had pretty much a low turnout

with the overseas military overseas voters but then when you get into the presidential cycle the the number gets

higher and I think for the November 2020 election for instance I think the overseas voter turnout was very similar

to what we had here in San Francisco like in 80 some percentiles really yeah

yeah yeah we're getting flooded with with faxes from overseas yeah I read

some report recently I would have to go back and look that the national the national level is like under 10% no no

no okay I must have had a different for a special election maybe but even that sounds low for San Francisco but for the

presidential cycle the primary will be well I don't know it's hard to say but the primary turnout likely will be lower

than the general election The General election will have a very very solid turnout I the number I had is in the

2022 so um take that it's different from a presidential cycle but the voting

rates for overseas citizens and domestic voters 3.4% of overseas voters return to

ballot in 2022 3.4 which is crazy um so anyways interesting um and good to hear

good to hear we have so much participation that's definitely rate

um one other call out I wanted to mention especially pertaining to pole

workers uh and now understanding a different perspective around kind of

where the numbers are at because it said a thousand has recruited over a thousand poll workers obviously needs to get to

2,000 but wanted to just put a plug into the commission as well that January 30th is National pole worker recruitment day

and so I think if there are things that you can PLL from the website around how

to apply to be a poll worker and share it in your own communities and social

channels networks just a little plug uh they're all available on on the website uh the P

worker application is on the website so just a little a little fact uh I also

think it's great to see the registration numbers in the director's report again really excited uh that that's being

included I'll talk a little bit more about that as it pertains to the election plan and then uh one question I had

about the grantees in the monthly reports are they also providing the

department feedback are they giving you are you I mean you have so much work on

the Department's level so you know there's so many things that you are managing I'm just curious if in the

monthly reports from the grantees they're going to be giving the department some data that can help you

do things going forward with those communities let's say we don't have the budget to do grantee funding and the

department has to do that are there things that we will be getting from those reports that perhaps could inform

the department in future Outreach well they have to quantify their work okay

so uh if that's what you mean but if you mean more like process or procedures or

or practices we do have a an after Grant meeting with the grantees so we we do

get their feedback uh from them and they you know whatever input they want to provide to us we certainly take it seriously awesome yeah I was more just

wondering learning about because they are specifically working in their own respective communities of there are

community-based insights that the department can use when engaging in those in work with th or Outreach with

those specific communities so I think you answered that that's great um and

then moving along we talked about all of those things I as it pertains to the

director's work I just wanted to say what an incredible election plan you put

together and on a very selfish note I was very happy to see some of these

things around voter the UN the eligible unregistered voters and the map and all

of the prioritization around that I just wanted to say a huge thank you to these

effort for these efforts I know it's a commission priority it's obviously been something I've been pushing on you for a

while that I I think you already are so committed to but seeing this renewed

push ahead of March is really amazing so thank you so much for that I also agree

want to Second uh commissioner D's comment about the messaging and the uh

and I think vice president Jordan made a comment about it as well around uh the

the messages about why people should vote I think those are awesome and agreed also very meaningful in a for

diverse communities which is great um I did have a couple of points I was able

to get through uh the full uh the full report I also wanted to say a couple

other pieces around efforts with specific communities that are vulnerable

so obviously we've talked about on this um on this commission folks who are

system impacted I also just talked about unregistered but uh eligible voters we

talked about but also the direct Outreach that is being done in single

room occupancy hotels shelters navigation centers community centers um

I and working specifically with food pantries and folks on the snap side of

things I think all of that is really really great and it shows a commitment

to really being in community and making people aware of their power to

participate in our election so I just really wanted to give a huge um a huge

shout out to you and the department for this um I also wanted to add a shout out

again more praise of the data fit and the dashboard that you are working on I

think giving members of the public access to these data sets and the data

set the data over time as well the historical trend is awesome it's

something I think we talked about a few months ago that I I believe IID mentioned I reached out to someone from

Mission local asking if they could include some of these um some of these

numbers in uh maps that they already use to talk about other issues in this the

city so that you know if folks aren't automatically thinking oh let me go check out what the Department of

Elections is are doing they're more likely to be checking out what their local newspaper is has available so um I

think that's that is something that as a commission can also um continue to

support now that I'm seeing all this amazing work to that end I did have one

question about the ad campaign in local U media and I was curious I know it says

print media but I'm curious if about some of the uh local newspapers and if

and how those were chosen um I saw the marina times the SF Weekly SF examiner

SF bayew Sunset Beacon I did not see Mission local um obviously I didn't see

the C SF Chronicle um but I was just curious I know some of these are more

neighborhood specific curious if you could talk a little bit about Mission local or other um news outlets that you

had engaged but otherwise I just wanted to say as a final just great work thank

you so much and um I think I'm excited to see the results of all of your hard

work on these efforts so on the on the ads so the newspapers are actual papers so the

neighbor their neighborhood hard copy paper but you're aing off yeah yeah so that's that's the reason you part of the

reason you see that list plus they reach certain populations uh we we don't advertise on

on every uh online newspaper uh certainly we can reach out

to Min local and see if what we also have to consider what they you know who they reach sure uh and maybe the who the

mission local uh any Outreach on a mission local if if it would meet an audience that is we were getting another

another Avenue we're not going to pay double for that potentially so yeah we we try to balance the the cash that we

have with who we can reach and then the methods and we do put more effort into uh non-traditional media because there's

a bit more cost there than we do the traditional media like even KS on that list if if you noticed so yeah I did

thank you I think just that being a a question answered for public knowledge

is just helpful okay uh there was one other comment that I did want to make Which is less a concern about March than

it is about November that I wanted to just kind of flag is around the timing of results reporting and I know we've

talked about this on the commission a it being a priority this year but B also just in years past

concerns around uh understanding in the public and in the media about results

reporting and uh making sure that folks actually

understand the the process of what gets counted when so for example the

department is going to report on you know and I'm looking at page 63 of 69

you know the the vote by mail ballots received before election day is on

Election night and then we move to the polling places but if more than 80% of

folks in San Francisco are voting by mail and let's say they all drop them off um drop them off

at not within the time frame to be included in that 8:45 p.m. cut off then

they won't be counted those won't be included in the results for another day or two days rather um and so making sure

the public is aware of that and doesn't get ahead of themselves not the public

the media maybe in calling results uh before the actual votes have been

counted so just more of a flag that we've seen we saw this happen in previous elections over the last couple

of years and something I think we should talk about as a body leading up to November less concerned about it

although may still be of concern in March I think definitely something in November we should pay attention

to and that that's all from me on the director's report and the election plan

plan um anyone else want to make comment about either of those items before we

move to the yes vice president jonic yeah I just wanted to mention one more thing about

the Chinese character-based name policy um we've been talking about

nerding out a lot but if if people want to nerd out more on the the the new

policy if you go to the um page for the the board resolution that was from

October and the memo that director ARS provided on the pack it's a three-page

memo but if you go to the resolution page for the board there's a a longer eight-page memo that the director um

sent to supervisor Chan that has a little bit more background it has a copy

of the forms that the Secretary of State recommends for state-based Statewide

candidates as well as the form that um local candidates fill out so it's a

little bit more um background is that correct direct okay okay so that's all

thanks thank

you there comments from

Commissioners okay unless folks have questions about

the waiver I move that we approve the directors waiver um

immediately does anyone have comments or or were you gonna say I was going to

Second it thank you commissioner

D okay let's move to public comment before we

take a vote on approving the director's waiver and just to clarify for the public we are voting to approve the

waiver that allows city employees to assist the Department of Elections with the March 20124 presidential primary

election there are no public

commenters I also want to make sure I didn't mislead the public that this is

not just on the waiver this is public comment on the director's report the uh

March 2024 election plan and the

waiver

okay so secretary Davis will you please call the roll call for vote on the

waiver president Stone yes vice president jonic yes commissioner burnol

yes commissioner dy I commissioner Hayden Crowley yes commissioner loli yes

commissioner Parker yes um president stone with all seven voting yes you have

your form excellent well thank you Commissioners thank you

director Arts the waiver has been approved and we will now move to as I

mentioned earlier agenda item number six 2023 2024 elections commission policies

and priorities review discussion and possible action on the election commission's current policies and priorities for the commission and

Department of Elections per the charter SE point of order did we want to approve

the elections plan um that's a good idea sure if you'd

like to so we did already close out agenda item number five but we excuse me

S four but um sure we can go back let's reopen agenda item number four

um would you like to make a motion I would like to move that we approve the

uh the uh director's plan for

2024 since we did not uh since we already took public comment I don't

think we need to take public comment again uh secretary Davis will you call

the roll call vote for the March 2024 election and thank you commissioner D I

appreciate that

president Stone yes vice president jonic yes commissioner burn

holes commissioner burol yes the we're taking a vote on the the

director's plan for March yes I vote yeah I didn't hear the first part the audio is going in and out but yes I vot

yes thank you commissioner dy I commissioner Hayden Crowley yes

commissioner loli yes commissioner Parker yes that's all seven uh yes for

that excellent so thank you commissioner D again and thank you director Arns uh

and for for putting that together very robust elections plan and also congrats

on not having to agendize that again next month um okay now we actually are closing agenda item number four and

moving to agenda item number six 2023 2024 elections commission policies and

priorities review I'm not going to restate the piece I already stated so

let's go straight into uh let's go straight into this topic uh I will I

believe first hand it over to um to vice president Jordon if you want to start on

since you have you've you authored two of the priorities okay sure um I guess I put

you on the spot there hope you don't mind yeah well I thought for this item

um it would make sense unless you had a different idea maybe you could just ask director

Arn um what if he's had a chance to think about the different policies and what his plans are for them and then

maybe we can respond with questions or do you sure I mean I as it pertains to

the go to registration policy priority I was going to give kind of my sense my uh

perception of where that stands uh less so than having the director do so but uh

if folks have different if folks have different um I also didn't ask the director to prepare

certain responses so if you would like to ask certain questions I think we can

do that I I don't have a specific Vision I just

had prepared my specific priority okay sure um should should I just do maybe

I'll just do want to alternate maybe I can do the rank Choice voting then okay yeah so

um yeah so the first policy listed in the agenda is the rank Trace voting results reporting

priority and um I know director erns we've talked about this in the past at

previous meetings and you had said that you weren't really going to work on it until after the March ction so I assume

I assume there's probably nothing more for you to say on this or or have you done any research or anything

or we well we indicated that we would use the program that you developed oh

you are going to okay great correct okay great so then

um yeah I think there isn't a whole lot more to add I mean I I guess I could mention two small things one one thing

is um I was doing some random um I was looking around at

other jurisdictions that use rank Choice voting and I saw that Salt Lake City who uses rank Choice voting um they also use

dominion and they they do something similar where they um they're able to

display the rank Trace voting results in their own custom way so they

were able to take the Dominion results and then reformat those so that's another example

and um and then I I could also just mention to the commission that I um I

was planning on adding the um the tool tips to the results page where if you

hover over certain terms like um you know exhausted ballots

or what's another one continuing ballots it would show the definition so that's

something that um you know the the department could benefit from too and um

but I think there's not much else to say on this unless other people have comments or

questions I yes commissioner Hayden

Crowley just a point of clarification are you are you mentioned the hovering over for the terms you're actually going

to implement that yes okay because that is great I'm always trying to think

remember what they mean and and I understand rank Choice voting so yeah imagine for the people who don't

yeah so I'll I'll I'll somehow communicate that to this body once I'm off the commission you know when when I

get around to it and I'll let the director know as well I had one point of clarification so

the D director AR you said that you are going to adopt it is that for March or for November no for November okay thank

you for clar verifying did any other Commissioners

have feedback on that item and director ER we can be in touch

if um once you get around to it if you have questions or if there's anything missing or anything so thank

you great thank you um I guess we can move to voter

registration so yeah as I said I didn't ask director ARS to put anything

together on this one mostly because I think the election plan and the director's report speaks for themselves

uh they if you look back on the commission's priorities uh and you look

at the second no the last page the it talks about potential tactics and I my

when in preparing for today's meeting I just did a a brief and review of what was in there

and refreshed my memory on what really we had talked about and where we stand

currently and I think that the department is actually

achieving is achieving all of these items uh not only um assessing the data

but also working to get the data in the first place um but I think the map and the targeted

Outreach and the community grants all speak to uh speak to this effort I also

think the multi the multi method approach multi- Channel and multi-method approach to getting folks to think about

registering to vote is speaks to all these other tactics that we had talked

about uh under as a as sub bullets to agenda to the tact first tactic of

assessing data and then the second piece the director immediately implemented which is incorporating data and

registration rates in the director's report and not only is it have those items been included in the director's

report they've also been uh updated on the um uh

the uh dashboard that the department has been updating and so we do have total

registrations on the director's report but then also had the drill Downs of the

uh uh districts on that dashboard what is the dashboard called I'm not the what

is it called eata sorry eata

edena sorry dat dat dat dat okay thank you um apparently I'm heart of hearing

today well most days actually um but I appreciate everyone saying it in unison

for me uh so we you can do that drill down and the director is including the

tactics some of the tactics employed as well in the director report so I feel we're really marching to toward that I

also think that the director has helped the Commission in thinking about how we can uh make progress on this policy

priority by bringing the materials today and then also answering commissioner Parker's specific question with

resources um as the Director already said that um you know well let me take a

step back it had been talked about in previous commission meetings that uh we

could join some of the voter registration drives or attend some of the events that the Department's already

doing but actually um as the Director said today and I just wanted to El re-elevated it that we don't actually

need to duplicate their efforts but rather expand to our own networks and our own communities and so uh I think we

should as a commission continue to talk about how we can do that whether it's through what commissioner Parker was saying of getting those door hangers and

using the map that the director provided to Target the specific communities that have low registration rates um and

eligible I think uh that's that's a good Next Step there are two other pieces of

that actually three other pieces of that I think I believe we've talked about before that I think we can uh continue

to talk about as a body and would like to continue talk about as a body is engaging our appointing authorities and

uh their communities and their departments about folks that they're working with to um help expand our

efforts there are other intergo like intergovernmental departments so the

I've engaged myself with members of the office of Civic engagement and immigrant Affairs who already do really amazing

work in communities um to engage them on all sorts of issues and support

resources that are from the city and so um I think that's another department or

other types of departments where we can just proactively make sure the folks who are out there in the communities have

these resources so I think knowing that we've already hit some of our our goals

that were in that uh in the priority document I'd like to see in future

conversations us talking about ways in which we as a body are individually uh

supporting these Outreach efforts around March but then again leading up to November and the last item of that which

is separate is I'd love to add a button on our website uh

to register to vote um you know just a link that says here's where to register

to vote and it can connect to uh the Department's uh page uh I also think we

could be providing a link to the uh dashboard on our website as well so

website updates on RN can be a little bit slower but these are all things that the commission I believe can continue to

to do and support I welcome folks comments feedback

concerns about all of these items quick comment so we can Pro

provide a route of where to go for the hangers

so commissioner Hayden Crowley thank you been doing the mic on and off all

evening just learning how to do it thank you president stone for your hard work on this initiative um I just wanted to

share some information that I got yesterday I'm part of a a sort of a mastermind group in public relations and

there was some information that was presented about the decline of trai traditional media and this individual who has been

studying it for years said I'm not even going to talk about about this as something that's happening it's happened

and they're they're really the and of course this is upsetting to me because I'm a big media person and I really love

traditional media but anyway I just accepting it and he then brought up these different studies that have been

done about where people are getting their news and according to the age group and I can't tell you off the top

of my head everything but one thing that struck that's uh jumped out at me is that first of a lot of people don't pay

attention to the news which is really concerning so we're trying to get information out about issues or or or or

just just letting people know that it's you know to vote and to care about candidates and they're not even paying

attention to the news we have a problem but here's the second thing is that most

38% and it's a growing number and this is going to be a controversial thing that I'm going to bring up get their

news from Tik Tock which of course it's controversial and we don't even know if Tik Tok will be in existence after the

next election uh the fellow that was giving the webinar indicated he thinks it might get sold but just something to

think about if 38% of the kids that are under the age of 25 are getting their

news from Tik Tock we may want to think about a way to talk about registering to

vote on Tik Tok there are departments in the city that put videos on Tik Tok

there are short videos they're fun and it's just it I mean social is one of the

one of the vehicles that you're looking at and I just you know you don't want to throw good money you know Away by

putting it into something that people aren't paying attention to and I think we have to whether we like it or not we

have to look at where what water cooler people are hanging out at and meet them there so that may be an opportunity in

the coming year um they even even the over 65s 1 to 3% of that group those are

the numbers that I that I remember are get their news from Tik Tock and then the another growing demographic is those

from 25 to 34 more of them are as far as the other social media platforms threads

and Facebook are responsible for a lot of this decline in interest in news

because they have intentionally uh adopted a new policy where they're not referring people to new organizations so

there's less of an emphasis on news Gathering and news information and of course if people are hanging out on

social media they're not going to be clicking on headlines on those platforms because they're no longer making them

available um amazingly X had only declined Five Points in terms of uh

people getting their news from there which I thought was interesting because it's I I'm not on there but I was on

Twitter so and and I do and I will say I miss it because for breaking news I think it's really valuable um and then I

I they did talk about some other platforms but I do want to share that information because it is something that

we have to pay attention to because if that's where people are getting their information then the elections

department needs to be there promoting voter registration and this group needs to think about that

too you do look disappointed I'm sorry no no I I was just the Boomer telling

telling the millennial no I I was just going to say thank you for keeping us all awake through the rest of the night

with our fears about the future of my world you and my kids been upset when I tell them this they no that can't be

true no you said nothing I don't already know I just try to suppress those fears

of our existential crises um commissioner D yeah I was just gonna add

on um to the comment it's it's actually a really frightening number it's much higher than that uh if you take it a

cross-section of how many people get their news from social media I was just thinking um you know the uh campaign you

did for going green uh which had that nice you know short video and then

you've got these you know this catchy messaging and this cute rhyming it it's

actually the stuff you have is I think with a little bit of work you could do a very quick tick Talk video and get that

out quickly get some of the creative folks to to work on that because like I said you've already got rhyming stuff

right just add a little dance and you're

there I'm not suggesting you do the dance but maybe some of maybe some of the

department prman Stone I think no I no no one wants to see

that I'm just commenting the Department already does a lot of great you know

kind of catchy you know short um messaging so it's actually a good medium

for you thank you commissioner D vice

president jonic yeah or if the department doesn't want to do it you could always host a contest other people

could you know do it so lots of

people

anyone else okay are folks open to us

continuing the oh yes commissioner Parker just gonna undo it I I was trying

to decide if I should um ask anything I was just thinking about um you know some of the ways that

some of the things you were suggesting president Stone about you know engaging our appointing authorities expanding our

efforts and things like that and um so it just made me think I know director

arst you've talked a lot about how you've worked with high schoolers and and things engaging them around um voter

registration um poll workking things like that and I'm realizing I'm not sure

have you also had any conversation with the school district in the past about um voter registration of families and

caregivers in the school district um has there has the Department ever asked them

to put out anything in like their their Wednesday packets and things like that we have in the past I don't we haven't

for this election and then more recently he's been around non-citizen voting yeah

yeah okay um that might be I mean that's such a such a large number of people in

one spot so it just made me think because my appointing authorities the school board is this something that I could help with you know is reaching and

having them put something in their um in their Wednesday envelope um kind of

packet that goes out to all the schools if you hadn't already done something that's something I could help with um so

it's a big group so anyway thank you for the

thinking thank you commissioner

Parker great um so if folks are open to it I think we'll just continue the I

might plan to just agendize this again uh not or whomever will agendize this

again so that we can keep talking about ways in which the commission can continue to support uh whether it's

through our appointing authorities or our networks taking materials from the Department to keep ourselves

accountable I think that would be good that is it on

my priority vice president jonic do you want to finish us out sure so move to

the third priority which is the open source voting priority and for this one I just thought

I would preface it with something that else that's relevant which is um you know from the director's report we see

that the budget is is going to be become a big issue this year and then in future

years and we've heard from Advocates that open- Source system could be as as

um save the department as much as 50% on its voting system contract each year and

if the department has a an annual budget of around $20 million and our current voting system

contract is um $2 million a year like a 50% savings would be 1 million which

which would be 5% of the Department's budget so if the mayor's asking departments

to um reduce their budget by you know 5% to 8% per year this could be a potential

way for the Department to meet that goal without affecting um voter services or

um Department staff so I think it's a really good thing to work towards

because it could be a huge um savings to the department which is um just going to

become more much harder to meet you know with each year that passes so um I there were a couple

things I wanted to mention about this topic in addition to that but um I

thought I would just give director Arns a chance to um share I know director RS did send me

an email uh towards the end of last month but I can let him mention that but

um in November I had asked if you had had a chance to think about this priority and um I thought I would just

give you a chance to um let the commission know you know what what you're thinking for this next

year in terms of the two bullet points that we had uh put in the document

and so I did email you asking for a list of contacts of Open Source vendors and

then uh I have to go through the information you gave me because there weren't a lot of vendors on that list

that I that I noticed but then I actually have questions for the commission on this priority nor that I

have thought about it so the the commission wants the department to forward the commission's priority to the

vendors and ask the vendors how much they need from the city financially and

then also what the department can do to help the vendors get certified is that

correct um so let me pull up the document here so

basically the city has had a long a longstanding policy for the the city to

work with organizations to to develop an open source voting

system that the city can use so this this commission policy and Department

policy was an attempt to [Music] um to like meet that City policy so the

idea was that there are potentially you know many

organizations out in the country that would be willing to partner with the city to help develop or to develop an

open source voting system that the city can use but um but we don't the city doesn't know

what what these organizations need until we ask them so the idea was that if you

send an email out to um not just vendors but organizations because some of these

um individuals might not be associated with like a necessarily someone that's

labeled a vendor but if we hear back from them and say like hey you know we we would be

willing to partner with you for um you know for free if you we need you

to answer these questions and then we could develop this system for you and and if you can try it out you know we

will do this for you or maybe they would say you know we can do this for you for $50,000 or

$100,000 or maybe it's Z like in the past voting Works offered to do something for 0 so the idea was that if

you send out an Outreach email just saying like you know hey the city has

had this policy to work with an organization and um is this something

you can help us with and what would you need from us so it's kind of an open-ended

um query and then based on what you get back it can help you decide you know

whether any of these seem promising then how much of this Department's resources would you think

we would need to commit to this well that's that's what's the beauty of it you don't need to commit to anything

just to send the email out I mean it's you you would get the information back back and maybe you'll get you know a few

responses and you can share those with the commission and then using that information you can kind of work from

there like maybe maybe some of the responses require very little from the Department

or maybe some require more but it would at least give you and the commission the

information about what the options are to to kind of work towards the city

policy of partnering with the an organization I know I know just

historically one of the examples that I know you've mentioned is uh the department uses a an envelope sorder

from um a vendor is that correct yes and there was a time where you did a pilot

with them right where they they made some changes to their sorder to um so

the department could use it is that correct right but we didn't help them develop their

sorder well but I mean it's it was a pilot though that they but they brought the

product that we use for the election yeah so so the idea is

that until you until you ask the organizations we don't know what the

possibilities are so you know based on this information you could learn um you know what are the

options you know may maybe some of the options would require very little from the

department but again how much resources of the department do we commit to the I

mean it's sort of so open-ended and there's nothing and there's and how do we do we have to get a contract with

these vendors well this this initial step here is it's just to to ask you're

not committing to anything you're just you receive the information and based on the

responses then you can decide like is there anything here that makes sense for the department so that the department

can move forward on this policy so you're not you don't need to commit to anything to to just to ask well if we're

helping a vendor develop a voting system are we committing that to that voting system

well you don't I'm saying you're you're just asking the

question but like after you get the responses then you could decide whether or not you want to

partner with any of these any of these organizations so

it I'm saying that until you have that information it's it's hard to kind of discuss this in the abstract you know

that's does that make

sense sorry I was just rereading the sentences commissioner Hayden

Crowley you're on mute um I I I'm just

point a clarification I think what vice president jonic is asking director ARS

is for you to create maybe a a brief scope of work almost like an RFP but not

because because that would require a lot more but a scope of work that you would

put out to the vendors Andor the organizations describing what your needs

are and can they potentially fulfill them and what kind of resources are

needed for on their end to do that because I think without any kind of

initial query we are just fumbling in the dark we have no idea like we're what

what I heard vice president jonic say is that experts out there say that we could

save a million dollars uh or 50% of the budget if we went to open- Source voting

well how do we really know that these are just people that are out there without some sort of a um a scope of

work and and people bidding on it there you know that there's no way to go from

you know to move off where we are right now so but that's a much bigger thing I

think vice president jonic than the resources I'm just going to put words into what I'm hearing um uh director AR

say is that he may not have the resources certainly not right now and maybe not in this election season to

create a scope of work no matter how modest just because all of the resources are dedicated to getting putting on free

fair and functional elections perhaps you can work together to create this scope of work that would be a way

forward but it can't consume a lot of the Department's time because they have

a several priorities but that's where I would think you would want to go with this because you can't move forward

without a scope of work and that's what people need to provide a bid

on but there's nothing to bid on because there there's no funding for it and there's I mean that's the thing it's the

chicken and egg and what the department needs and what a vendor needs to do is to have their system approve a Secretary of State's office so that we can use it

okay I mean that's that's that's what has to happen Okay and then what what I understand commissioner jonic asking is

that we're supposed to ask these vendors and organizations what they need as far as funding and whatever resources the

department has to get them to be certified that's the big ask I think and I so that's why I'm trying to clarify

what you have in mind just asking for information I mean that's that's that's the first step to committing resources

I'm that's I'm kind of get a sense of what you have in mind as far as the resources to commit to this I I think

the um the scope of work that you know to use commissioner Hayden Crowley's terminology I think the scope of work

could be just what you said I think the the city what it needs is a a system

that's certified and has certain you know capabilities like you know rank Choice voting you know the the certain

multi- language ability you need it could you know could be described in a couple senses and just say you know

since 2007 or 2014 the city has wanted a system that we can use that has these

capabilities and we we're hoping that an organization can develop it and certify it you know what what would you need

from the city for you to be able to do that and maybe they'll say maybe it would require very little on the

Department's part maybe they just need we need someone that we could you know maybe just try it out one

day you know after every couple months you know try it out for a couple hours

or I don't I don't know what they're going to say but it could be something very easy that doesn't even

require much money or or any money you know it's but until you put

that out there no one's ever going to um people aren't going to know to

like to tell you what what they could do for you do for the

city but we need a voting system yeah you know I mean we don't just need like some software we need a voting system

and so if someone came forward and and and and replied to the Department's

request for information we don't know what they would actually make and if it would be a good system I mean we're kind

of committing the the city to A system that we have no idea if it' be any good or not and so that's so it's not as

simple as it sounds at least in my mind and I'm not trying to overstate this but it's not a matter of just getting some

information and we're going to use you know provide a few bucks and then give some information and off we go has to be

a good system so well then what what is so like I know

like New Hampshire did something similar they they worked with um voting Works in Dominion they and

maybe a third vendor but they they um worked with them you know

they had certain like interactions where they the the vendors would um update their system to

like meet certain New Hampshire's requirements and then they had a a day where the vendors came and they showed

the systems and now um a New Hampshire now has an open- Source system that

they're able to use and um like they were able to to do that

process so that's just an example of one jurisdiction doing it but

um I guess until until you just let people know let these

organizations know that this is what the department is interested in

it's you don't really I mean you don't know the possibilities that that's kind of kind of to you want to learn to make

the next decision you need to know what the possibilities are it's not it's not an RFP it's just a

simple email that could be you know a few paragraphs long I

think commissioner Hayden Crowley make sure you're unmuted um

yeah I'm hearing a couple different things I'm just trying to help mediate this here um

when you're talking about New Hampshire it sounds like the state was very much involved it wasn't handled at a local

level or even if it was implemented at the local level it was handled though at the state level and then implemented at

the local level but it does sound what I'm hearing from um uh director Arn is

that you have to have an approved system by the state and that's where we get the chicken before the egg the egg before

the chicken I I I I think one of and You'

you've been down this road it's hard to move forward without the state's participation in it because the for the

city to commit money Andor resources um you you don't want to um

invest in something that wouldn't have um you know the state's blessing so to

speak um and I I I I I'm jumping in on this with really very little knowledge

but I'm just trying to move this forward to the you know to try and understand it um but I do think it sounds like I I

can't wrap my head around why all these politicians go out there and say this is something that they're for and then they

do very little to push it forward but that's kind of typical um so that doesn't surprise me

completely so so I think I think that the state you

know obviously needs to approve the system but that's something that the vendor would take care of and I'm

not it's it's not something that would be on the Department's shoulders but no the your the priority for the from the

commission is that the department would help the vendor ask the vendors what they need from the Department to get

certified that would be the initial step so and then you'd have an array of

replies and then at that point you could just look at the replies and then

but that's the commitment that we're putting forward by with that policy that the commission's passed so the

department sends an email to the vendor saying what can the department do based on this policy prior from the elections

commission to get your system

certified well let's say that let's just say hypothetically you get six replies

from different organizations and then it would be up to the and then the

commission would have this information you would have this information the Board of Supervisors would have this

information the mayor would have this information and maybe all these different groups they could say well

like two of these six look like they have you know really seem realistic you know maybe

maybe one of them is asking for $20,000 or maybe one of them is not asking for

any money maybe they just need a point of contact and then among all these

different stakeholders in the city that the supervisors and the mayor or or the department could um maybe one of the

members of the board says you know this is great this this one response was was good let's let's

put um some weight behind it but but without having that initial query no one

really there's nothing to concrete to pursue you know that's it's just really

all all you're doing would be doing would just be getting the information

and it could be an input into the city on how how it could move forward you know um no but the policy

priority from the from the commission is what resources of the department do the do the vendors need and so it's sort of

a commitment from the Department's side that we're going to commit resources that's why I'm asking originally like what resources and how how much

resources are you envisioning the department provide I I think that minute can I make

a point of clarification so I I think some of this is actually just language in the

priority that might be causing some uh like I can actually understand

where your perception is and also understand like I think I'm I'm getting

I'm understanding a little bit differently now and you'll have to reconcile if I've I've gotten it but my

I think perhaps the language that is most challenging on the side of the director

is that there is a kind of subcon a

subliminal message that implies that the department would allocate

resources whereas the intention of the priority is simply just

to say if I'm understanding correctly that we

would want the uh we would want to be able to

ask the uh the voting system the open the vendors excuse me what they would

need from us in theory but not actually have there be any sort of

commitment that the department would be would do any of that it is a in

theory what would you need to accomplish this goal and I think how it reads might

not make that clear it might imply that it's that the there is an ask

for there to be a more a more uh realistic commitment from the

Department when it's just an Outreach message of what do you need what would you need to be able to do this in theory

um I think you've also raised that your concern is and again correct me if I'm

wrong that not withstanding that fact you believe that asking about it in

theory is still one step closer to reality and

practical resources being allocated is that your concern it is okay and so so

is your feedback then that even

asking putting out there in theory this is what we would need is is still too

close to actually committing resources themselves totally it's a slippery slope

okay I just want to make sure we're all talking in the same

way uh yes Vice President John it quickly and then we have actually lots of hand

okay so I'll I'll just pose this question to the commission like if if the commission were to ask the board for

funding for an initiative like until we ask we would

never know how much money to request you know that's it's it's it is a chicken and

egg but so um but I I just want to say I do

agree with your your summary it's this is an in theory like if if you get six replies back maybe none of them makes

sense maybe they're all asking for too much or maybe some of them aren't realistic so I would say

that it's not you're not committing to anything by just asking is my reply to

that but I'll I'll let others speak commissioner D yeah I was going to say

actually a a strong City tradition to ask with with zero commitment I mean the

city puts out out rfis all the time just to create vendor lists with no

commitment to hire so they they put out these requests all the time and say we

want to know who's qualified here's what we're looking for and you know if you

meet our qualifications we'll put you on a list for the next two years with no

it's true no commitment at all that we're going to hire you we're just trying to see who's out there so I think

this is essentially the same thing it's like city's been trying to look at open source systems and we've hit this

roadblock right because they can't do rank Choice voting for one there and there probably some other issues as well

uh and we need a complete voting system so we would like to hear from anyone who

is seeking Dev V to develop a state California State Certified you know open

source system that would meet our requirements um and you know we'd like to know who

you are and what we would minimally need to do to to help get you across the Finish

Line with no commitment that we're actually going to do it but you know because you know the city's not going to

pay for your development but what are the things we could do it could be as simple as we need a technical point of

contact you know as we're developing this to give us feedback it could be I'm have no idea

but I'm making stuff off right it could be as simple as that um it could be um you know we we would like the city

to you know to to be an alpha tester right when we when we have

finished developing a rank Choice voting module right doesn't have to be in a

real election we would like you to test it and go through your procedures and give us feedback that that could be the

you know the ass so it may may not result in a money ask it could be

there's no question it probably be some kind of resource asked but it may not be that hard for the Department to meet and

that's I think what vice president Jon is asking for is let's find out you know who who might be options right and are

there any that are worth throwing some resources at whether it be people resources or time resources

or maybe some money even to help them get across the finish line so we have options because it's in our interest to

develop these options uh at a very in a cost-effective way right so let's find

out who's a candidate thanks commissioner d h

commissioner oh were you gonna say something no okay commissioner Hayden Crowley um I can't add much to

commissioner dy I think she was articulate in what she had to say I did go through this uh very issue with the

city on a Drupal platform for website and they had screened a number of

different vendors to qualify them for um working on Drupal based new websites for

the city and I when I did this uh for my previous employer with the city I had to

uh interview from a pre-qualified list of say 20 vendors who had met certain

qualifications and then were approved but it was interesting because at the end of that I think for there's a

committee now I think the thing that's missing from this entire conversation is the level of bureaucracy that's involved

in all of this it's not as simple thing as director Arn sending a a query out

and I think when he talks about resources we need to be mindful that it

involves multiple departments Department of Contracting I mean lots of different departments so what we think is a simple

letter is is never ever simple ever trust me but it does happen all the time

so um I just think that um I I think

it's definitely worth this uh commission um moving forward because that seems

like a good first step um it's more not in theory I'd say it's more of an

exploratory um exercise to see what may be available out there but again um I

think you have to be mindful of the levels of bureaucracy and it would probably involve um working with the DCA

first or or or whatever to to figure out what departments need to check boxes on

just even asking for information thank you commissioner

Hayden crley commissioner ly thank you director Arts given you've

said multiple times that resources and allocating resources for the Department

to do something like a request for information for a um open- Source

system and given that we have an election coming up in March and we have

the presidential election um in November is it possible after the presidential

election in November 2024 is that we don't have an election for a little while is that a Time time where

potentially resources could be allocated to have this inquiry to kind of look

at how we could do this and how the department could do it and what

resources um would be needed um so is an off election time when there's there

isn't election going on there's a little bit of time between because I appreciate what you're saying especially given the

budget cuts that have been requested for each department in the city but is there a possibility of bringing a report to

the elections commission um saying the president's

election is over we've looked at what it would take to do this and here's what it would take so we could have a sense of

what resources would be needed is that something that could be

possible off Fe is always better certainly than the presidential cycle and this this is kind of growing from my

perspective from a two sentence ass to an RFI which is even bigger um

so yeah I I mean really off year is always better to start investigating and

and thinking about this uh and you know I'm not against open source I just uh I

know that's the perception uh from certain people but it's I I from my

perspective I know once whatever we issue there's going to be a expectation that something is going to happen next there's something and that's I get that

that's that's how it goes uh but not having to go through that during the presidential cycle definitely would be

better than it would be better to for more advantageous I think for everyone considerer not to have the presidential

Cycles facing us going through all this um and also from my understanding voting Works was planning getting certified in

California they said originally 2022 I believe and then I don't know where they stand now so potentially within a year's

time you're going have a a voting system in California that's open sourced and that's that's approved by Secretary of

State's office so I don't it might kind of solve a problem for everybody I right but but if that isn't the case just just

for clarification I'm not saying you create the the request for information

just let us know what would it what are the resources what would it take for your department to be able to do that R

I'm saying yeah I have to write it I me I mean the RFI would just take time writing to to do that

that's why I kind of like the two sentence policy foror better uh that

makes sense yeah yeah okay and then I mean then we right just coate it and

send to the commission you guys could have the information that way um I'm I'm

sorry maybe I'm I'm tired I I guess what I'm saying is I'm not saying that you

should do an RFI I'm saying you let us know because you've said multiple times

there's a lot of resources you you don't want to or I had the indication you don't want to put too

much of the city's resources into doing an RFI and so what I'm saying is letting

us know what it what would it take for you to be able to do what Chris is

saying which is essentially an RFI so I'm not saying do it but to say after

the election the presidential election here's what it would take for us to put this to to make this happen here are the

steps here's the pathway I would need X number of employees X number of things

is that something you would be amable to after the presidential election I want to be clear about that it'd be

better okay yeah and when I mentioned resources not so much about the

whatever's issued it's more if what the ask would be uh from the department and

my concern just from past experience I this can't be the issue for the Department especially now and that's

sort of How It's been in the past no matter where we are in the this has been the issue uh so if it's going to be

potentially be the issue for the Department it's better to have this happen in off cycle than during the presidential Cycles okay thank

you and where is actually I don't know do you know where voting works is on their system because they're certified

in California I'm talking to commissioner

jonic can I ask my question oh yeah you can just go ahead vice president jonic I just assume I didn't I assumed that you

would answer that yeah yeah so I do want to reply to um commissioner L's comment

but yeah director my understanding from voting works right now they are not

have not prioritized California they're they're prioritizing jurisdictions where

there is um active interest and willingness to work with them and collaborate with them

so I think I I don't think they're going to partner with they're not planning on

partnering with us unless they see some interest from San Francisco so

um I would say that right now they're not they're not doing anything in California unless we would take some

kind of a step to show them that we want to partner with them so

um which I think sending out some doing some kind of Outreach like would would

provide them an opening to partner again but um I think my understanding is that

you know San Francisco would need to kind of take the first step on that um just on commissioner LOL on on

your comment um yeah I think an RFI is much more work

and I think um I think I think we wanted to avoid asking

the department to do n RFI because it was more work and um I think

legally um the the DCA um when I was working on

this document the dca's had said that you know we can't ask the department to do NY so I I would my preference and I

think in our document our preference was to do something that was not did not

involve the work of an RFI to allow you to do it um you know easily and

quickly so and I I think even the the email could just say explicitly you know

this is not a commitment that we will we are not committing to acting on this

information you know act on this information if if that would make you feel more comfortable you know one of your

concerns was that it might be viewed as a commitment but I would I mean if if the

department was going to wait until till next year to um do this it

would I think it would really um we would lose a lot of time to

um you know we we would lose a full year on on um preparing for what we could do

with that

information but I I do I do think that an email could be it could just be a few

paragraphs and not a couple sentences I think it could be a few paragraphs but um until the department

signals to organizations that it it is interested in doing something I don't

think I don't think anything's going to

happen commissioner loli I have a question for the ca is an

email that um vice president jonik is

suggesting if that were to be sent to um open source organizations does that

legally bind the department by inquiring and

saying we we would like more information about your system what you need for

certification um vice president janic help me with the language like basically what you're asking to go into this

email that could theoretically be sent does that bind the department by

doing that good evening Commissioners Deputy City attorney Brad russie that what I understand of what's been

discussed about that request for information it wouldn't find the department to make any kind of purchase

um we would probably want to review how this is set up to make sure there aren't any violations of competitive bidding

requirements in the future for example giving certain vendors a preference or

not equal access it has to be open to everyone like so to the extent the

department started working with one vendor and not others there could be issues with competitive bidding I know that's come up in other context so we

just have to make sure we follow the proper process and we're happy to work with the Department on that if this moves forward thank you

so so I'm not I'm not sure um really how to proceed like I mean director based on

this conversation are you you going to think about it more or

um um or do you have more to say based on

what what has been said today or um I I I mean I think part of this policy part is the

commission does want this you know issue to move forward and this has been this

has been going back 16 years now so um you know we're trying our best to

find ways that it to move it forward and if you have um

you know maybe variations on what we're suggesting I think we would be we would

love to hear that too you know I think we're we're doing our best um but if you

have other ideas you know I think um I think we're open to you know

collaborating together on this issue but we we we don't want this to be

any kind of a commitment we just wanted to get information so to inform you

know the next steps

basically yeah so um I mean would it help if if

um you know I or the the commission were to draft an email that would um you know

be the few paragraphs and then you could look at it if you didn't have time to draft the email would that help you

or I'll draft the email I can share with the deputy attorney's or state attorney's office um and then kind of go

from there okay that would be great I think that would be very appreciated

um okay

so um

I there was one there was one related issue that I wanted to um mention during this item because it's related and that

was um during the retreat the commission had a discussion

about the um the city's current voting system contract with

dominion and because um originally your plan was to issue an RFP for a voting

system in the spring and um one of the commission concerns was

that um well informally during our discussions was that the um signing a new voting system

contract could delay the um you know that could kind of lock the city into a

a voting system at the exclusion of an open source voting system so we had a

discussion about the possibility of the department extending that the city's current voting system contract with

Dominion instead of issuing a new RFP and um during that Retreat I had shared

with the commission that um in the past the department had signed a a voting

system contract back in 2007 that was similar to the one that the department

signed in 2018 or 19 and with that

contract it was similar in that it was a four-year contract with two one-ear options to extend I'm I'm saying this

for other people's benefit because you know it but after that the department went to the Board of Supervisors and had

the board extend it twice beyond that original um you know was originally stated in the

contract and is there anything that prevents would prevent the department from doing something similar to that

with our current voting system contract asking the board to extend it

beyond the original six years well I think one is does do we

want the same same contract and for the same terms I mean if you extend the current contract you're you're extending

the current terms in in the current costs so I I think we have to consider

what that means I don't have an answer right now for that okay but but legally

it's a possibility though is that I'll leave it to to Deputy sign uh

okay proceed to discuss that um but it's fine I'm not going to I didn't come here

today to talk about contracts and I wouldn't do that in a public session so

uh certainly we can think about is that is that the the commission's formal uh

recommendation then no this is a discussion that we had and I think this is a it's a question

um that we had discussed during the retreat so

um and it's related to the open source policy priority which is why I'm asking it today but um I mean I'll I'll just

ask today just to kind of move the

discussion forward from the commission's perspective but DC RI um like legally is it an option for

the Department to I I understand there's choices about whether it makes the most sense but like legally can would it

would one option be for the Department to extend the the city's current contract with Dominion if it went to the

Board of Supervisors commissioner I haven't examine that contract with respect to

this question I mean generally the board has the authority to pass an ordinance and wave different things and sorry

would you mind talking into the sure generally the board would have authority to by ordinance wave competitive bidding

if that's an issue or um other legal requirements that are not um

imposed by the charter but with respect to this particular contract I I don't know the answer without looking at it

more closely okay thank you yeah and the commission did not take any kind of a formal action on this we were just

discussing it and with the idea that we wanted to keep this the city's options

open for open source um well can I ask so if the if there is

a opportunity to extend the contract is the Comm with the commission then formally recommend that be the case that

that be the course of action well I mean I I would say informally the sense was that and I mean

I can let other Commissioners speak for themselves but it seemed like commission were Commissioners were supportive of

the idea of extending the existing contract and um I mean personally I

would I would support that um because you know for the reasons I mentioned

but I I would I would hope so and I would I would expect it personally

but I go ahead commissioner D you look like you were going to say something yeah I I mean I think you know

theoretically without looking at the details of the contract it was more about you know mitigating the city's

risk while leaving the options open so you pointed out there are lots of reasons to engage in a new contract um

but the concern was if a new contract locks Us in for another five years or whatever the you know multi- years that

obviously limits the options for open source and so that was just a

consideration we were thinking about is if there is an opportunity to you know

work with an open- Source uh vendor who's close you know to getting certified we don't want to then sign a

five-year contract and and lock ourselves in and not be able to Avail ourselves of that opportunity so of

course it depends right so again we didn't we weren't looking specifically at the Contra we were just talking about

how can we leave our options open so that we can move toward an open source system um without shooting ourselves in

the foot because as you said we need a voting system right so we want to accommodate both and obviously you know

what your thoughts are on on the specific contract and and you know maybe

our opportunity to get concessions from the vendor um that matters

too so this is um commissioner Stone I'm just going to jump in uh first vice

president jonic if that's okay um I think there are two things I just want to say one in response to the director's

question and two just a point of clarification

also uh related to what commissioner D had said because there's some context

that I also want to add for the public in this conversation which is that the director was is slated to issue an RFP

in this spring for a new voting system I think that's something we just need to level set on to make sure the public is

aware of what we're talking about um and these contracts are much longer than 5

years um and I think the concern was that if let's say an open source

system were to be able to be certified in the next 2 years 3 years four years

that if we were to commit to a new a fresh contract that then we would be

locked in for upwards of 10 years potentially or nine years you know depending on how we work through that

process um knowing the city's requirements around 10year contracts so

but these contracts with voting systems like Dominion are very are long and I

think that was the expressed concern um and then the second piece of that is to

answer is related but also to answer to the the director's question about if

this is the commission's policy we had talked about it for that exact for what

I just described we knew that you were going to issue an RFP in the spring that

meaning in the next you know few months in the midst of already a crazy election

year knowing that you were already going to do that and that perhaps there might

be movement toward an open source system in California that could get certified

wanting to see if there was an option to extend and that with a little asterisk

our existing contract so that we wouldn't have to go out to bid and could keep marching on with uh throughout this

election cycle and you know revisit this again in a year or two uh the reason I

say asterisk is that the extens the length of extension has also not been

discussed in this moment I think that needs to be made clear if we're going to answer the director's question about if

that's our policy uh you know what would that mean would is it our stance that we

would want the extension to be two years

with option and then revisit in two years you know what does that look like because ultimately the director will

have if this is the route he goes he will also have to go to the Board of Supervisors to do this and so I think

it's important for us to be very clear on what we mean when we say extension and

why um yes vice president Jon yeah and I just wanted to link this back to

something earlier in the conversation which is you know talking about how much work in RFI is like an RFP is even even

more work and so I think you know this could potentially save you some time if

you're able to avoid the whole rigal of writing an RFP and then doing that whole bidding bidding

process so um it could it could potentially be um you know a timesaver

as well for you and I I think that yeah if you had the you know with if the

commission was supporting this approach and um you went to the board I'm confident that

it would it would sail through you know this isn't something that you'd be doing on your own um you know assuming the

commission were to adopt a policy supporting that so um yeah I mean it

could it could save you some time to go that

approach is that of interest to you like would you want the commission to take a

position on that

yeah I think it'd be good I mean because in the past yeah things can turn pretty

quickly on these contracts with with voting system vendors at the commission by the commission so I think it makes

sense it would be good policy good approach by the commission to actually put forward they would support uh and

they can even of course uh clarify that the support of a contract potential contract extension is really also in

support of the policy to uh bring an open source system eventually into San Franco Isco that way it's not just you

know John AR against open source hang out to Dominion you know so I I think

that I think it would be a good idea and a good approach I so thank you if if that's what you're offering I I accept

yeah well and also if and I know you don't want to get into the contract in full public and so if you can't answer

this at this time totally understood but would you want to extend the contract as

existing or would you rather move forward with your plans and again again if that's not something you want to

answer in Open Session I completely respect that and understand why yeah I don't think I'm at this point ready to

comment on contract yeah because I just don't think the commission should make a policy until you until we know where you

stand like I don't think that we should I think we should support you in what you want to do and

not you know adopt a policy that is in conflict with that I think that would be a problem so I appreciate happy to talk

about it offline if that's better and I don't know if it has to be a policy if it even was just you know a resol I

don't whatever you know so ceremonial

yeah commissioner D yeah so you know I I think it would be good to agendize this

next for the next month and um and maybe U have a you know a more in-depth

conversation about it like what can we do uh consistent with the open source

voting systems priority in step with this because you know to me this is it

goes hand inand like I said we're trying to mitigate risk for the Department make sure the city has a solid voting system

at the same time we don't want to cut off our notes to spite our face here we want to want to make sure we're developing these other options because

otherwise you know we don't want to be stuck in an old contract for other either right so I think um we would love

your thoughts on that you know sending out an email what just our idea if you have other ideas on how can we move

things forward to continue developing viable options on the open source side

you know and then the commission can support you know passing a resolution or whatever we need to do to make sure you

have the support you need when you go before the board so that there's an understanding of why we're doing

this I think you know have a few weeks to think about it and prepare something for next meeting for a discussion and we

could probably have it in closed session if necessary

right um I'm just looking at the time uh Vice President jonic are there

other items thank you commissioner are there other items vice president jonic on your on this policy priority that you

wanted to raise today okay any other commissioner have

comments they'd like to make concerns observations before we move to public

comment okay let's thank you for that thank you for the discussion um let's

move to public

comment there are no hands raised okay so that will close out

agenda item number six thank you to the director you're good to go um we will

now move to agenda item number five Commissioners reports discussion and possible action on Commissioners reports

for topics not covered by another item on this agenda meetings with public officials oversight and observation

activities but long range planning for the commission activities in areas of proposed study legislation ex elections

others sorry I just got distracted because I realized there was one thing I wanted to mention before the end of that

agenda item um hold on one second if I can find My

Notes apologies it'll be very quick so uh just to Circle back on something

about the voter registration policy priority we'll plan to agendize these as commissioner D had suggested I did want

to mention uh commissioner Parker brought up the questions for the director which I had shared with him um

and one of the things that you talked about I think one and two but number three was also adding links to our

signature um I talked about the website and so uh also we will we should all

plan to uh accommodate that and put items these links uh and happy to send

an email reminder to folks to add them to your email signature as well um so I just wanted to elevate that very very

small thing apologies let's go back to agenda item number five Commissioners reports um and I am actually going to

first hand it over to commissioner Hayden Crowley thank you president Stone um I

need to let everybody know that I just uh recently accepted a new position with the San Francisco Public Utilities

Commission which requires my full-time commitment and as you all know the city

Charter mandates that no member of the San Francisco elections commission may hold any employment with the city and

county so in accordance with the requirement I am resigning from my position as an elections commissioner

effective this Saturday January 20th when I begin my new position with the Public Utilities Commission so I just

want to thank everybody here um I've gained incredible valuable insights

working with all of you and collaborating with you I have tremendous respect for each and every one of you I

have learned so much I I really have um I've been humbled and I've been equally

excited and thrilled by all of the progress that has been made um my first Commission meeting was

mindblowing but we got over that and I really feel that I've uh

developed wonderful relationships with my colleagues I only have great things to say about all of you so thank you so

much and I wish director ARS had stayed to though I'm very I've just always held

him in high regard for operating free fair and functional elections and I think that we've seen evidence of that

once again again in his director's report um and that is the mission of the elections commission and I also want to

call out our uh commission secretary who we fought so hard to get on board here

Marissa Davis and Marissa am I pronouncing that correctly yes uh

president Stone worked so hard to bring you on board it was her mandate along

with all of the different processes that she's brought to this commission which have made these meetings run so

incredibly smoothly and I just we just owe an incredible debt of thanks to her

and thank you for the wonderful time that I've had on this commission to you and to vice president jeronic and I

really do want to call you all out commissioner Parker commissioner loli commissioner D and commissioner bernholz

as well thank you so much for being wonderful wonderful colleagues and I

will treasure my time with you and my memories thank you commissioner Hayden

Crowley I think I I won't try and speak for everyone I'll speak for myself but I think the it is a huge loss it has been

a complete privilege to work with you and I think you've brought great perspective I think we've all grown so

much as a body in the last year I feel really proud of that and I also think um

I I've seen each of us grow and learn in many ways and I certainly feel that you

have contributed tremendously to that so thank you so much thank you um even when you were very tired

sometimes we all we all got through it so um it's a huge huge loss and uh we

will do our best to try and carry on your uh perspective and hopefully uh

someone who fills your shoes has your knowledge and uh particularly your

understanding of this city and the things that are important to this city how the city operates the bureaucracy

that is involved um I think you have brought so much important perspective as well so thank you commissioner Hayden

Crowley commissioner Lei well

congratulations um and I just want to say that what I appreciate the most

about you commissioner Hayden Crowley is keeping

us with our feet on the ground and remembering that there are processes procedures and

that money is what's often needed for things we want to do so I really appreciate

that practical um knowledge that you brought to many of our discussions and you will

be missed and I hope um this is means an opportunity for coffee or lunch um at

some point but thank you very much for your service thank

you okay thank you I will share just a

couple of quick other things bit or sweet um but uh I wanted to talk a

little bit about the the um meeting schedule over the coming weeks so as the

commission is aware we have to do two budget reviews the uh prior to the department

submitting its final budget for to them to the mayor's office for their review

and consideration and those meetings need to be no less than 15 days apart the tricky

piece of that is that the director we will not be able to begin reviewing that budget from the director until January

29th he is going to submit it the Friday before which means unless someone is wanting to work on a weekend we will not

be able to review it until uh January 29th and then we must submit it by

and I actually I wanted to ask TCA russie one point of clarification I know we already talked about this previously

but I just wanted to confirm that we needed to submit it by the for by the

15th because I believe I had the 14th written down and then then I also had

the 15th can you confirm it's the 15th and not the 14th the code provides that the last day for the commission to

approve it or yeah prove it would be the 15th of February 15th thank you okay so

we need to our first review January 29th 30th 31st and then the second review is

basically the the February 14th or February 15th now the important piece of

this is that the commission's regular meeting does not fall within either of

those dates so my proposal is that we hold a boek special boek meeting on

January 29th 30th or 31st and then now this is we can discuss this um but

move our regular February meeting which is currently slated for February 21st to

the 14th or the 15th secretary Davis has already done the work to uh ensure that

we can have a room available for these two different slots uh vice president

jonic has agreed to support the special boek meeting I also had support um from uh

commissioner Parker who said that she could support the boek um if other folks have uh conflicts on the other dates and

would prefer to take BC we can also swap around as well um the idea is to do this

in the most painless way possible um so I guess let's start by saying are folks

able to accommodate moving the February regular meeting from the 21st to the 14th or the 15th um

and I think just a head nod would be great um really we need a quorum okay I

see commissioner bolz has a thumbs up our folks and I also want to add I know

that scheduling is very frustrating because we do these you know we

anticipate that our meetings will be the third Wednesday of every month so but this the budget process does happen you

know once a year so um hopefully this will be the only time yes commissioner

laosi your your question is about the 15th or the 14th and not the 29th 30th

or 31st yeah let's start with the febru the February meeting

yep commissioner Parker um I let president Stone know

this already um I will be out of town on the 14th 15th and not available those days which is fine if everybody if

there's a quorum that's fine um which so I just won't be here those days thank

you commissioner Parker yes that's that was one consideration knowing that commissioner Hayden Crowley will uh not

be on the commission and the potential for a vacancy uh at least one vacancy at

that time that the priority is really ensuring that we have Quorum so um we

will be at that point we with commission Parker's absence it would

be there would be five of us so yes go ahead oh yes I just wanted to correct

myself I'm glad you asked that question because I looked back at the code it's actually February 14th I'm sorry no no

I'm so glad between 15 days that have to be between the two meetings and the

thank you thank you for double checking no problem um I so glad to know um

because we can decide it here and now so okay scratch that and who can do

February 14th um commissioner bernh hols can accommodate commissioner

D okay vice president jonic um no problem okay and really we need a quorum

um otherwise I think we would probably have to delegate to a special Committee of some kind wonderful we'll all spend

val day together um make sure you bring your Valentine's for the director I ask

yes vice president introd so DC Russi can can the meetings be reversed can it

be the commission meeting first and then the committee meeting

or the the the purpose of the first meeting is for um the public to provide

input on the budget priorities and then the second meeting is when the commission actually proves the budget

and the commit the whole commission needs to consider the budget okay so okay so so we will move

forward with moving the February 21st meeting we are going to cancel that

meeting or rather push it up a week to Wednesday

February 14th um that will be our new February

meeting we will still move forward as if it's a regular meeting but the budget will be the primary agenda item for that

meeting and then do does anyone have a

burning passion to participate in the BC meeting as an alternate for commissioner Parker well

commissioner Parker perhaps you want to join that BC one since you can't make the I mean I won't speak for you but you

might want to have be able to review the budget um but uh perhaps in lie of

myself or vice president jonic does anyone you're not all dying to me meet

again February um okay um yes commissioner L

see I'm sorry I just got a little confused there um the BC meeting is

sorry the BC meeting is going to be before the meeting on the 14th correct it would be January 29th 31st yeah 29th

or 31st okay I absolutely cannot meet on the 31st I

have five 100 people coming to my school for an event and I have to be there

okay well I think let's keep it so it

will be a special boek meeting of commissioner Parker vice president jonic and myself on either the 29th or the 30

31st we will oh yes DCA

Rie it needs to be 15 days so the 29th yep okay so it will be January Monday

January 29th I'm glad you're keeping us honest um it will be Monday January 29th

um it also helps you have your answer immediately secretary Davis so the BC meeting to review the budget the first

review will be Monday January 29th and the second will be at the full

commission meeting that will be moved from the 21st to the 14th of February is

that clear thank you everyone for accommodating that um I really

appreciate it um I did have one other or I had two

other items um which I actually one of them I meant to

mention after commissioner Hayden Crow's announcement uh which was just that um

uh uh DCA huling Delan how do I say her last name that she's no longer Staffing

the commission um it will be just DCA russie and DCA Flores uh going forward

and then uh the last piece is we had talked about on the I don't remember

when we talked about this but doing a uh after we had done the warehouse tour

during the retreat in December we will be doing a or we had talked about doing

the same thing for the vote Center in City Hall and I spoke with the director about this and he proposed

uh and he said we could do it in March I thought it would be more fun for us to do it ahead of November and so uh just

everyone kind of this is a ways away but keep in the back of your head we're one of the dates we would do would be

November 1st 2nd or 4th and we would get to do you know the full it would be in the afternoon probably and the director

would show us the whole kind of um process I think there were a lot of

questions when we did the warehouse tour around uh around vote by mail ballots

and and uh the process of those and so now we'll get the the ability to see

that um at the vote Center in City Hall so just keep that on your radar November

1st 2 or 4th yes commissioner ly oh

okay correct yes um and I'll bring that up again in the

future um yes good that is it are there other

commissioner reports yes vice president J thank you

president Stone just one thing to mention um one of my action items from

the last meeting was to just incorporate the revisions from the annual report that we discussed and I was I was

intending to do that today um because I wanted to finish it before the meeting

but I wasn't able to get to it but um I should be able to do it in the next few

days and um commissioner Hayden cley I did receive your email you had suggested some wording to incorporate like we

discussed at the meeting so I have that so um I just wanted to give people an

update on that so thank you thank

you okay let's move to public comment on

agenda item number five commissioner reports oh were you GNA say something commissioner do you want me

to do you want me to give an update on it um yeah uh vice president J just

asked about the registration report uh so uh Michelle and I spent uh most of

the early holidays uh incorporating all of your comments and

revisions um and then flipped it over to uh president Stone who had a couple of

uh last suggestions which we're in the process of reviewing and it is also

simultaneously under review or will be shortly under review by the

dcas so uh and president Stone's already drafted a letter to go to the board so

we just need to cross our eyes and Dot our teas and triple shoot some formatting issues um and and will be

done um I don't know if anyone has a strong opinion uh commissioner Parker

I've been debating whether we should have the appendices as a separate document or whether we should try to put

it all in a single document assuming it's not too big if anyone has a strong opinion on

that I I mean the commission voted to move forward as drafted with the

specific yellow changes so I personally would propose that we not reopen the feedback on the report that's my

personal feeling that's fine we'll go with single document then awesome thank you commissioner

D let's move to public

comment there are no public commenters quite a bunch

today um okay thank you secretary Davis so we will now move to election of

Commission Executive officers discussion and possible action to elect a new commission President and Vice President

per commission bylaws Article 5 Section 1B the procedure will be as follows and I'm just going to read the full

procedure the chair of the meeting will open nominations for president any commissioner who wishes to nominate a

candidate will state the name of that person if that person agrees to run then that person is nominated when there are

no further nominations the chair will close the nominations and call a roll call vote in which each commissioner

shall State the name of the nominee for whom she or he is voting if a nominee

receives four or more votes that person is elected president if no nominee receives four votes the commission may

have further discussion and proceed to another vote this process shall repeat until one nominee has received four or

more votes the same process will then be used to elect a vice president per the

bylaws the term shall begin immediately at the conclusion of the meeting so with that we will open nomination for

president commissioner Hayden Crowley I nominate

president stone for another term to be president thank you commissioner aen

growley oh I

accept seconds and you don't have to second you can just nominate are there

any other nominations

well thanks um let's move to I appreciate that let's move to a roll call vote

then before we go to vice president because we were going to do president

then vice president Public public comment oh before we take any action

okay so let's hold on public comment let's because we also do the need to do the nomination period for um the vice

president I I think you could take public comment on the entire item once just before you take a vote on anything

it should be before that okay um would folks like me to take public comment now or move to the

nomination of the vice president now the lad yeah just do the next nomination oh

okay you'd like to move to public comment now well the the agenda says

to I'm Vice President should happen after the vote but

okay okay I hear half and half public comment um let's just move to public

comment there are no public commenters and we can always take public comment again after after vice president that's

totally fine um okay let's secretary Davis will you call

roll call vote for the um election of the president the executive officer of

president president stone

stone president Stone president

Stone president's St president

Stone president Stone president

Stone wow thank you everyone certainly one of the less painful ones

I've done since being on this body so I really appreciate that um uh let's move to nomination for vice

president any nominations yes I'd like to nominate commissioner Parker okay

thank you commissioner loli I'd like to nominate commissioner

D

okay thank you commissioner Parker do you accept as

well um yeah yeah thank you

any

other we can move to public

comment there are no public commenters

okay um secretary Davis would you mind moving

to the roll call vote for vice

president president Stone

Parker vice president jonic commissioner Parker commissioner burn holes

commissioner Dy commissioner Dy

I guess I vote for myself commissioner Hayden Crowley

Parker commissioner Luli commissioner D commissioner

Parker Parker okay

one four for Parker and three for Dy okay thank you secretary Davis thank

you secretary Dy thank you secretary or not secretary D and secretary Parker

commissioner Parker thank you secretary Davis thank you commissioner D and thank

you commissioner Parker I appreciate that um and I also would ask secretary D

if you're open to also being the boek chair for the year as

well we can discuss it offline if you would like I am not going to escape this am I

I'm so sorry I'm off we can discuss it offline we discuss it offline okay well thank you I

appreciate it everyone um and I know these are never easy um are there any

other comments before we move to agenda item number

eight okay agenda item that closes out agenda item

number seven let's move to agenda item number eight agenda items for future meetings discussion and possible action

regarding items for future

agendas sorry vice president jonic yeah I know um one item that we had

discussed maybe five or six months ago was the um the ballot label state law

that you know Sisco could choose whether to opt in or out and especially since

this um this election was just a two-card ballot like it seems like there would have been room to have it for this

election so maybe it's something the commission could discuss a policy around the ballot

labels and then um there was something else oh

and I don't know president Stone if you think this is necessary but um perhaps

an agenda item around formalizing the um the policy for sending letters to the appointing authorities ah for um around

vacancies yes so I'd like to respond to both of those I that was actually a

complete oversight I had meant to bring that up after um you can tell I'm a

little all over the place here um but I mentor to bring that up after commissioner Hayden Crowley's

announcement that uh I wanted to unfortunately that would mean us

going back um but the commission had discussed the letter for that I believe

we took action correct on that letter we did yeah I thought or was that just in

vek no okay we'll have to go back but

I okay Listen to I I couldn't recall if we had approved that as a commission or

just in boek um but I wanted to get the commission's blessing to send that to uh

the seats that will be vacant so I believe we already sent one to the board

although I don't recall I don't remember if we did or did not um but then also to

the mayor's office as well so uh what we given that we have our meeting sooner

rather than later in February um I can add that to the agenda um and then I

also wanted to and so thank you for bringing that up I I had that on my list and I just it was an oversight and then

the ballot label I'm glad you brought that up um I have been in conversation with the director about this offline and

actually if you look at his uh March report you'll see that there's already

movement uh toward that so so the uh uh

vice president jonic is speaking directly about uh ab14 16 which was

including proponents and opponents on the ballots themselves names of

proponents and opponents of ballot measures on the ballot themselves and there is concern about the number of

ballot cards um there are many concerns about including this and this had been

discussed at the commission back in

October something like that yeah in the fall um and uh I had spoken with the

director about it offline he is kind of working on a we've been working on a

many different components of this that we plan to share with the commission uh it's just there have been too many other

priorities uh that have kind of deprioritized this but yes I can speak I

don't know if that can necessarily be as soon as February 14th um but yes in

either February or March that needs to be something that is brought back up um

and so oh what I was going to point to is in the March election plan on page um

hold on a second just because I I did see someone from the League of Women Voters on as well who I think had asked

about this um ah on page 17 of the March

election plan it says ballots for all voters will include information on where voters can obtain information about

proponents and opponents so that will be that is new um that is something in the

March election plan even though there isn't going to necessarily be full transition to AB

1416 um there is going to now be something on the ballot themselves that says the directs people to the voter

information pamphlet where they can see uh who the proponents and oppon are so I

just wanted to give everyone a little kind of preview of that but yes I will also um make sure that's included on the

agenda as well commissioner Hayden Crowley thank

you thank you president Stone um I don't know that this would be an agenda item

but it is pertains to your processes my understanding is that when people leave

the commission I've been advised that I have to file a form 700 for leaving the Vaca the commission and so I'm just

reminding you uh commissioner vice president jonic um but then also to all the Commissioners I think that this we

all uh we all have to do our form 700 just a reminder thanks yes I'm sure secretary

Davis will be bothering all about all of us very soon about that um and then of

course policy priorities will be agendized as well um per I think commissioner loli I think you are the

one who mentioned that anyways it will be aend IED again anything

else okay let's move to public

comment no public commenters okay the time is now 9:02

p.m. and the meeting is adjourned